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 S8E11: Dark Water (SPOILERS)

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S8E11: Dark Water
Fantastic!
43%
 43% [ 13 ]
Good
33%
 33% [ 10 ]
Okay...
7%
 7% [ 2 ]
Bad
13%
 13% [ 4 ]
Awful!
3%
 3% [ 1 ]
Total Votes : 30
 

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Ben C.
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PostSubject: Re: S8E11: Dark Water (SPOILERS)   Mon Nov 03, 2014 7:39 am

rmlextreme wrote:

I Paused on danny holdiing the tablet in the final scene after the 6 cybermen march hit pause on your DVRs fast and hold.. Look at the reflection as he as about to touch the iPad you can see tardis round things!!!!

Those are circular graphics on the iPad, as you can see the reflection of his face over the graphics on the screen (so they can't be a reflection from behind him). Also the set in the background is the same 'Nethersphere' setting.

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Krynoid
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PostSubject: Re: S8E11: Dark Water (SPOILERS)   Mon Nov 03, 2014 8:49 am

Whoozier wrote:
From all I have heard about this season, and this story in particular, I am not going to even bother to watch it when it hits PBS. And I was really looking forward to Capaldi playing the Doctor.  

(Maybe they should just cancel the programme and call it a legend)

I'm not saying I agree with you or disagree with you but the show is for kids to enjoy and they do enjoy it.
People's tastes change as they get older. You enjoy stuff you enjoyed when you were younger due to nostalgia. But there's no nostalgia attached to the new show.

And you should never form an opinion on anything solely based on other people's opinions. Some people like Justin Beiber!
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Whoozier
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PostSubject: Re: S8E11: Dark Water (SPOILERS)   Mon Nov 03, 2014 2:10 pm

I still watch the program the same way I did when I was 11 and 12. Of course my generation had much longer attention spans then and could follow a narrative that spanned weeks at a time. Narratives back then also had a cohesion and made sense, unlike today. Gimmicks are introduced and plot threads and details get put in and then forgotten and have no resolution or are left to the deux a machina ending where it is just "timey wimey" or "wibbley wobbley" instead of a well thought out conclusion.

Doctor Who as a programme has always evolved over the years to reflect the times it is being broadcast in, and this latest version just reflects the downward spiral things are going.

I also happen to trust the opinions of others, as well as my own.
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Krynoid
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PostSubject: Re: S8E11: Dark Water (SPOILERS)   Mon Nov 03, 2014 2:46 pm

Whoozier wrote:
I still watch the program the same way I did when I was 11 and 12. Of course my generation had much longer attention spans then and could follow a narrative that spanned weeks at a time. Narratives back then also had a cohesion and made sense, unlike today.  Gimmicks are introduced and plot threads and details get put in and then forgotten and have no resolution or are left to the deux a machina ending where it is just "timey wimey" or "wibbley wobbley" instead of a well thought out conclusion.

Doctor Who as a programme has always evolved over the years to reflect the times it is being broadcast in, and this latest version just reflects the downward spiral things are going.

I also happen to trust the opinions of others, as well as my own.

I didn't mean to sound preachy. I too have been watching the show for as long as I can remember, since 3 years old or so. I started with Pertwee on the air.

I agree with everything you just said. Especially the deux a machina aka "timey wimey" endings that RTD was so "good" at. And the elongated story arcs get my goat too, as they usually don't pan out very satisfactorily. There have been times while watching the show that I comment "well at least the TARDIS is still the TARDIS!

The thing I shake my head at the most is I thought Stephen Moffat was a fanboy? He should be making the same complaints we are?!?!?!?!?!? Maybe too much power has corrupted him?

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rmlextreme
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PostSubject: Re: S8E11: Dark Water (SPOILERS)   Mon Nov 03, 2014 4:44 pm

Thanks Ben for the Being able to see that in the Pad.  I thought i finally found something.

So the Round things are a logo on the tablet from missys program, it still a cool thing Very Happy They look like a piece of old tardis wall


I said this on a post i think months ago.   they where repeating history hiring an Actor who worked in prior episodes i.e.  colin Baker Remember how bad that was.  And now years later they Hire from within again.  It is not all capaldi he is a decent actor but they give him pure unfiltered CRAP.  In Matts Series 7 that was mostly Crap too. lol

They have successfully undone everything Eccleson and tennant did in the 2005 Reboot i think.

They need to scrap the writers let moffat go to sherlock and ruin that full time lol.

Will i still watch??? YES !!!!!! in the hopes things change
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Ben C.
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PostSubject: Re: S8E11: Dark Water (SPOILERS)   Mon Nov 03, 2014 6:31 pm

rmlextreme wrote:
Thanks Ben for the Being able to see that in the Pad.  I thought i finally found something.
So the Round things are a logo on the tablet from missys program, it still a cool thing Very Happy They look like a piece of old tardis wall

It's here and there as well - that same logo is on Seb's desk nameplaque as well; it's just the logo for the Nethersphere / Matrix, and it looks like the physical object.

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Ronpur
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PostSubject: Re: S8E11: Dark Water (SPOILERS)   Mon Nov 03, 2014 10:59 pm

I have enjoyed most of this season far more than any in recent years. I love Capaldi's take on the Doctor. I love the character development of Clara. We don't have to see every moment of her life with Danny Pink to know that she is in love with him. I think her reaction to his death is normal for someone who has a friend with a time machine! And she knows he will say they can't go back in time to save him, so that is why I like his solution..."go to heck!" The Doctor didn't "snap his fingers' to open the doors, because it was an illusion. Timelords regenerating into different sexes may not have ever been shown before, but it has been mentioned lately.

The format of the show is a lot different than when I first started watching it in 1982. The 23 minute slower paced episode with a cliffhanger would not work in a world with so many distraction and information overload that exists now. People get far too distracted to follow the same story over 4 to 6 weeks. But, I love each version of the show. I also like the 1941 Batman serials and The Dark Knight Rises. I love reading 3 or 4 different origins stories of Batman or Superman. I love Superman with Christopher Reeve, George Reeves, Brandon Routh, Dean Cain or Henry Cavill, I like it dark like Man of Steel or fun like the animated series.
I love each Doctor and most of their stories. I am excited to see a new take on a Doctor, Master and UNIT story and can't wait to see what happens next week. I don't hate on Moff or dislike the writing style of RTD or their story arcs, each writer has a different take on the show and I can't wait to see what the next show runner does with it, not because I am tired of Moffat, but because the show is about change, and it must change and evolve for each generation so we can have a 75th anniversary special!
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Ronpur
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PostSubject: Re: S8E11: Dark Water (SPOILERS)   Mon Nov 03, 2014 11:01 pm

Ben C. wrote:
rmlextreme wrote:

I Paused on danny holdiing the tablet in the final scene after the 6 cybermen march hit pause on your DVRs fast and hold.. Look at the reflection as he as about to touch the iPad you can see tardis round things!!!!

Those are circular graphics on the iPad, as you can see the reflection of his face over the graphics on the screen (so they can't be a reflection from behind him). Also the set in the background is the same 'Nethersphere' setting.


I think I saw the reflection of Danny's collar in the i-pad and thought it was the shirt of the boy....oh well.
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Shatterbang
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PostSubject: Re: S8E11: Dark Water (SPOILERS)   Tue Nov 04, 2014 12:13 am

I saw the boy too. Wrong angle on the screen grab. Here it is.
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PostSubject: Re: S8E11: Dark Water (SPOILERS)   Tue Nov 04, 2014 12:14 am

Yeah.....the Rani would've been better. But not bad. The Matrix and the Cybermen was pretty cool.
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PostSubject: Re: S8E11: Dark Water (SPOILERS)   Tue Nov 04, 2014 1:46 am

That's it, I wasn't hallucinating after all!
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PostSubject: Re: S8E11: Dark Water (SPOILERS)   Tue Nov 04, 2014 3:25 am

Overall I give this one a 7/10. Let's start with what I liked.
- The Doctor. Solid performance as always. Great reaction to the whole key thing.
- The reason for 3W existing. This kind of macabre plot device reminds me of something Torchwood would do, that kind of existential body horror. Cheers.
-Clara. After being a cardboard cutout in season 7, the impossible girl has grown on me quite alot. I find myself hoping that she and Danny will live happily ever after, however unlikely that is.
-Danny. What a powerful scene when the boy comes to see him. And it reminds us again that while war may sometimes be necessary, it is never, ever good. Got a little choked up as Danny was crying aboot Clara.

Things I didn't care for/wasn't impressed with.
-The Master. Really, you're going to spell it out for us, and then after a whole season, go for the most obvious solution? I don't mind the fact that the Master is female, but I am kinda bovvered (#Donna) that it seems to be arbitrary. Is there a reason that the Master should be female? Or is Moffat pandering? Missy could have easily have been Romana, The Rani, The Valyard, Alternate Universe Rose, ANY NUMBER of characters. Interchangable female villain? Why not gender-swapped Master?

After a whole season of wondering, I would have preferred a bigger shock reveal. Imagine if it was Romana, coming back for revenge after being left on Gallifrey to be Time Locked? Or the Valyard, for the same reason? What if it was Sally Sparrow? I dunno, just was expecting a reveal not quite so obvious.

Now it could be that Death in Heaven will completely redeem this first half. I admit that. But as it stands, as the first part in a 2 parter, I gotta be honest and say I was slightly let down. Hopefully there will be some fireworks on Saturday.
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PostSubject: Re: S8E11: Dark Water (SPOILERS)   Tue Nov 04, 2014 3:31 am

I don't think Moffat likes referring to anything pre-2005 if he can help it.
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PostSubject: Re: S8E11: Dark Water (SPOILERS)   Tue Nov 04, 2014 9:52 am

I've been a little underwhelmed with the entire series. My little brother was severely disappointed by "Deep Breath" and was highly suggesting they permanently cancel the show. While I don't agree with that, so far the only episode I've really enjoyed has been "Robots of Sherwood."

I'd seen fan theories that Missy was a female incarnation of the Master so seeing it turn out to be true (I was hoping for the Rani or a new Time Lady villain, like the Doctor's ex-wife or something) wasn't that surprising.

I don't want the Doctor to regenerate, I just want the writing staff to. Capaldi is a great actor and just coming off the 50th anniversary, this has been pretty bland stuff.
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PostSubject: Re: S8E11: Dark Water (SPOILERS)   Tue Nov 04, 2014 11:39 am

I just had a thought about the Master being last seen going off with Rassilon, and not left behind by the Doctor. Is there any reason this can't be an earlier Master, before the Timewar version? I doubt it is true, but it could make more sense. Well, a little more sense.
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PostSubject: Re: S8E11: Dark Water (SPOILERS)   Tue Nov 04, 2014 1:40 pm

The more I think about it, the more....lame changing the sex of the Master is. It's just a field test to see how fans will react, and to basically pave the way for a female Doctor, which is an idea I don't really care for. Very artificial writing.
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Scary
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PostSubject: Re: S8E11: Dark Water (SPOILERS)   Tue Nov 04, 2014 3:10 pm

I've loved this series. The only episode that I haven't liked is 'In the Forest of the Night'. Capaldi is the best thing since sliced bread, Clara finally has a character, and stories don't have that horrible childish 11th Doctor feel to them any more. The Doctor is the Doctor again. I haven't enjoyed a series like this since Series 1 or 3.

Series 1, I enjoyed 12 out of 13 episodes, which is 92%.
Series 2, I enjoyed 11 out of 14 episodes, which is 79%.
Series 3, I enjoyed 14 out of 14 episodes, which is 100%.
Series 4, I enjoyed 16 out of 18 episodes, which is 88%.
Series 5, I enjoyed 11 out of 13 episodes, which is 84%.
Series 6, I enjoyed 12 out of 14 episodes, which is 86%.
Series 7, I enjoyed 10 out of 14 episodes, which is 71%.
Series 8, (assuming I'll like next week's, as I'm pretty sure I will) I enjoyed 11 out of 12 episodes, which is 92%.

Yes, I did just sit here and work those all out... Gotta kill time in my sad life somehow... Razz

But yes, my point is that Series 8 really is up there at the top for me! bounce
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PostSubject: Re: S8E11: Dark Water (SPOILERS)   Tue Nov 04, 2014 3:13 pm

Which ninth Doctor story did you not care for, Scary? Out of curiosity.

I do like Capaldi a lot - and right out of the gate, unlike Matt Smith. I just wish his stories were of series 1 caliber. I really liked Robots of Sherwood, Flatline, Mummy On The Orient Express, and Deep Breath - I liked Dark Water too, except for the Master thing. The rest have left me cold, but it's been a good run so far.

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PostSubject: Re: S8E11: Dark Water (SPOILERS)   Tue Nov 04, 2014 3:21 pm

Shatterbang wrote:
Which ninth Doctor story did you not care for, Scary? Out of curiosity.

The Long Game just didn't click with me. Then again, I haven't watched it in a long while, my thoughts on it may have changed. Other than that, Series 1 really was perfect. I love the 9th Doctor.
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PostSubject: Re: S8E11: Dark Water (SPOILERS)   Tue Nov 04, 2014 3:32 pm

Yeah me too. Smile

I liked The Long Game, but the first Slitheen two-parter kinda didn't do it for me. Aliens Of London/World War Three
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